The Only URC Playoffs Preview You Need | Harry Jones and Huw Griffin

Yeah, I probably agree. I think with Glasgow, a bit like what we saw with Ulster in the Challenge Cup Final on Friday, I think it's a case of running out of steam. So this could be Glasgow's last shot at it. They like to fight. They're ready to fight.

They want peace, but they're ready to fight. That's the right way to put it. So it should be one-sided in the sense that the Bulls should score a lot of points. The Bulls are a high-scoring team. They're at home.

They're raring to go. When key people leave, that's when everyone starts to tell the real story. So we don't really know even what all is going on in Munster. It's just something rotten. Something rotten is stewing there.

I think Somers gonna score 50 points, maybe seven tries, maybe more. And I think they're gonna try to do this every way. It looks like he's not always knowing why they lost and why they lost badly. And there's a bit of marginalization of Jacques. I think that's where all the heat is.

Lastly, Mornay Stein said today that Chris Smith is now the best fly-off in South Africa. That's a lot of weight from Mornay Stein to say that. This is the Lekker Rugby Pod. Only on Megaphone Rugby. Welcome back to the Lekker Rugby Pod play-off preview special with Harry and Hugh.

A bit of a hybrid. We like hybrid players and we do a bit of a hybrid show tonight as well. Hugh's got a treasure trove of stats. Slightly outdated, but better than nothing I suppose. and Harry's back as well, Harry.

What do you think? The four games coming up, which one do you think is going to be the one to keep an eye on? I mean, so, big anticlimactic prediction by me, which is that the favourites will all win. But if you were looking at one to go the wrong way for the favourite, I actually think it's Munster, Bulls. So sorry.

I'm sorry, I'm sorry, but it's nothing, it's not a reflection on Bulls so much as it is the fact that Munster is used to doing this, been there, done that. sort of unfazed maybe also just kind of you know, nothing to lose and there's a bit of street fight dog in them I'm actually diluting that prediction though because I think Jack Crowley's not playing so I think it's just going to go by the book, to be honest I think some of the games will be routes, unfortunately And you, what do you think? Hello everybody, it's a delight to make my debut on the Lekker pod since you guys rebranded to the stormers like a pod it's a pleasure to be here the what was the question what do you think which one of the four games will be the one to watch the most important the most upsetting one maybe even i think glasgow connect because connect are an incredible run of form and i do think that guys get they're very similar teams and i do think that glasgow just a better version of connect we'll get into it a bit later but kind of suggest on that good run and you do see teams in the urc if you go back through history, even back to the Pro 12 days, teams have a terrible first half of the season and then go on a run after Christmas and lift the trophy. So I think that one. Just to clear up any misconceptions here, because there's been a lot of debate.

This is not the Stormers' lacquer happy pod. My mark, man. It's a lacquer happy pod with a healthy dose of Stormers, but that's coming to an end pretty soon. But there's some big names coming up. I'm looking forward to that, Harry.

But the Bulls are ready and waiting. We're negotiating with the Sharks. I think we'll see how that goes because that's the particularly least absolutely nowhere. And the Lions, we've got a big plan, a nice plan sorted out. So I'm looking forward to that.

So Harry, I agree with you. Glasgow Connacht, I think, is going to be the opposite of the weekend. Connacht on a roll. Eight years, maybe, but they snuck in there. Stuart Lancaster has written that team around and we know that typically, or most of the time, the team that ends top of the log doesn't win the championship.

But what do you think of that one that you predict? And I agree with. Yeah, I think Glasgow could lose a semifinal. I just don't think anyone, I don't think these guys are going to lose the quarterfinals. I think the teams, the four big teams with the 140 to 160 plus points differential, with a lot of players back, I think that just sort of comes back, you know, it just comes back to haunt the ones that are striving.

It's just hard work to be conned. You're chasing, you've got, everything has to go right. Whereas Glasgow can still win if a few things go wrong. and also you pinch yourself at some point if you're Connacht. Like, is this really happening?

Are we really as good at these guys? And so that's where I think Stuart Lancaster still has another year to grow with Frawley coming over and perhaps playing 10. I mean, I actually think Connacht looking a year from now, even more interesting. But I think it's come too soon. It's a year too soon for them to knock off Glasgow.

I think Glasgow can play some serious rugby when they have to, even though I agree. Their attention has been wandering a bit, and it's been difficult to diagnose exactly what's gone wrong here with Glasgow. It's just more like inconsistency. But I think playoff comes here, lockdown, Franco Smith, you know, get the guys around. They're going to take care of the job.

It might not be pretty, but I think they'll get the job done. Yeah, I probably agree. I think with Glasgow, a bit like what we saw with Ulster in the Challenge Cup final Friday, I think it's a case of running out of steam. And I know that that's something that's been on Franco's minds, just with the tiny size of the squad that's getting smaller next season. So this could be Glasgow's last shot at it.

So maybe if he sells it to the guys as one last rodeo, Sione, come on, let's do it. Maybe. And I do think that they are favourites against Ghana, don't get me wrong. But I think that I don't know if they've got another crest in them. I think losing at home to Toulon in the quarterfinals of the Champions Cup really took the wind out of the sails.

And then they went down to Cape Town, got the Hatskopf. And I think that's... I wonder how that's... They're going to need a lot of psychological resilience, I think, to do the business. Mind you, they finished top.

So it is kind of crazy to be talking about the team that finished top in these terms. But like you said, Enver, the team that finishes top doesn't tend to win it. Yeah. And they not only got their Gatskopp at Cape Town, they also got their Gatskopp in Alice Park, remember? Same story, same tour.

I mean, we talked about the difference between the UFC and the top 14, and I'd like to know your opinion on this, hear your opinion on you, about that difference, that gap. I mean, Toulon, sort of a middling team towards the back of the top 14, beating both the Stormers and Glasgow. UBB, the Champions Cup winners, and they fifth or sixth on the log in the top 14. What does that say to you about the relative strengths of these two competitions? I think the top 14 teams are better at peaking because the top 14 teams, and I think it's kind of similar to the All Blacks as well in Test Rugby, is that they just play so many games all in a row that the cohesion is a real thing.

We know that obviously the Ben Alexander cohesion theories that I do buy into. I think that probably has a big deal that these guys just telepathic is an accurate example. um which but what it means with the top 14 season it's so home and away and stuff that they get the reps in but they're also not peaking every single week every week isn't a thing isn't a final whereas with Ireland and with Leinster they don't necessarily have a peak they bring in all their top players and they play and they are at that level but they can't they can't go up a level on the on the big occasion you know they just have a level and they stick to it the top 14 is a bigger is the better league. I think the middle of it is especially better than the middle of the other leagues. I think sometimes you get to the top top of leagues, it's difficult.

Obviously, the most difficult to ascertain is how good the Hurricanes are compared to Poe or Montpellier. I just don't know. It strikes me that most of those All Blacks, when they go over to other places, are immediate stars, do really well. The guts of the teams are coming from Canes, Chiefs, and Crusaders So I bet they're good, but it's difficult. Definitely the bottom of the top four teams pretty good because they are trying to stay up.

And so it's not ring fenced. And there's just a lot of money and money at some point does matter. If you like my example would be if you just take exactly the Stormers and the Bulls right now and then they can harvest five players from overseas from anywhere they want. Could, you know, intelligently because you have to do the right ones. look at Bordeaux doing it right and Leinster not.

Yeah, it would matter a lot. So I think top 14 has that. Whereas some of the other leagues are really trying to be training grounds and proving grounds for their test teams, like New Zealand doesn't import. So, yeah, I mean, of course they should be, if they do it intelligently. The other thing, as Hugh points out, is they have to play a long game here.

And, you know, you might not see Poe, or you might not see Stade Francais featuring some of these ladder rounds of the Champions Cup. but they're still doing a hell of a well in the top 14. So that means maybe too long, it's not as bad as you think, because they might have just said, we're putting all our eggs in the tournament run, because we know we're not going to go anywhere in the top 14. So I think that you see a bit of decision making when you play that many games, I think you might have to. Before we continue, I'm going to ask you, you like your tennis analogies.

Are you dressed for tennis or are you coming from tennis or on the way to tennis, what's happening? On the way, on the way, yeah. And my favorite form of tennis is doubles, which is the most like rugby, by the way. It's a game of angles. It's a game of finishing.

I like to play like Bordeaux. I play tennis like Bordeaux plays rugby. So it's all on the finish and the counter and the quick score. Whereas some people like to do ground strokes and build a long attack like Leinster, um you know sort of shot tolerance where you bang bang bang bang and hope for the other person to make a mistake um that's not me i i'm absolutely quick strike i think there's lots of analogies and the more time you're around uh coaches hugh don't you find that people love in sports to make a point the one that springs to my mind is coach swais when we talked to him he kept bringing up golf which is a popular one amongst rugby players i guess it's i guess golf must have nothing in common with rugby i suppose so they like it because it's it doesn't remind them of it you don't really hear many soccer analogies in rugby union for whatever reason but yeah coach race mentioned golf as well a lot which i guess i guess the kind of analogies that he was kind of drawing was the psychology of it of the pressure moments and handicaps as well he used the handicap analogy of which teams has kind of level of handicaps depending on how good their players are and things so yes that is something that i have seen on that point mba about the mentals i think that's why i'm with glasgow on this one i just think yes that probably glasgow has a good chance of being knocked out before the end or losing a final but there's something to be said of being in the finals and i think it's just um i don't know how many people in connect would have been here in any kind of this kind of game i don't know very many at all so i think it's difficult i think one more time maybe no i can't think of any bun bundiaki played for connect when they won the pro 12 in 2016 i'm pretty sure because they had a double acky midfield they had peter acky and bunda bundyaki was their midfield uh robbie henshaw was there as well but he obviously plays for leinster now so i don't think that's a great question i'm gonna ask some of my irish friends of uh which irish which connect players have ever actually won anything before yeah because Because before the World Cup, Envia, what I did both times was I just put down a number of knockout matches that the players had played for each team and then did a side-by-side-by-side. And it was stark how you could tell the Bucks and the All Blacks would be there at the business end.

And with the French sort of building a little bit of maybe there as well, but still a pretty big gap. and the reason why I didn't use pool games or Champions Cup games or rugby championship games is just knockouts in a World Cup different animal there's a different throw up there's a different nerve the locker room is a bit more tense there's just all those things where you can have a why it's already a successful season actually it's okay, it's pretty good we're better than we thought we would be whereas Glasgow is used to what did they say? John Smith said they know where the light switch is when the lights are out. They can walk right to it so they know how to go to the well. Well you did a good thing there because I know Gráinne is going to give us a hard time if we don't talk about Connacht a little bit more because I mean they're in the top eight and you know with a dark horse we actually didn't give him a chance.

I thought Elsa was going to make it so you need to expand on that a little bit about Galway and the fighting spirit. Give it a shot man. Galway is a great town. Anyone who wants to go to Ireland maybe should start there instead of starting in the east go to the west um the west is probably more what you romanticized when you were young about what ireland looked like the cliffs the sea the air every single thing you look at looks like a postcard everything you look at looks like some sort of tourist bureau uh also they're the most out there in the street you know busking singing strumming guitars it's uh you cannot turn a corner in galway without running into musician um also they're they like to fight um i'm not trying to put this but they're they're ready to fight they want peace but they're ready to fight if that makes the that's the right way to put it you who likes to fight it's just yeah it's interesting to be a tourist and get into a fight um uh like old men will fight at a hurling match or i think there was a ferry situation my son and i were going to ride bikes on the island the aaron islands and there was these two guys squabbling and suddenly they were throwing throwing hands on on the ferry it wasn't really funny i was like okay and and just the the level of belligerence you know a guy walking in at 8 a.m into a pub you know we're getting ready for golf that day and he's like anyone got a light here i'm like why would you curse that early like swearing before breakfast it's bizarre and um it's that it's a different um air about it i i think they found their strange that steward lancaster an englishman uh would help them find their dna or their their their vibe but i feel like they're playing their vibe right now which is free easy taking a swing um fantastic guys after a match you know really wonderful people to be around but But they're definitely ready if you want to go squabble and wrestle.

They'll do it. I just want to echo that. I've been to Galway as well. I'd happily go back any time. Absolutely fantastic place.

Beautiful place, as Harry said. Everything looks like a postcard. Actually, my first ever flat cap was bought from Galway. That's the one, my blue one. Actually, it's actually my second one of those.

I lost the first one on New Year's Eve one year. I lost a lot of things that night. But a fantastic place. and the is this the title of the show the uh a galway girl i can say no more but the uh the stuart lancaster is loved in ireland he was loved at leinster i think he was coaching them when they last won the champions cup and he just fits like we talked about it on the loose pass last week and there were he didn't fit in racing he was the wrong man for the wrong job and he just seems to work a lot of people think that he's going to take over from andy farrell which is funny because i understand that they do not like each other um but or at least the the love for stuart lancaster irks andy farrell anyway that's what i've heard i cannot confirm or deny it's just what someone told me so there's something about he just works there his style of rugby the way that he wants to coach the culture that he brings suits It's a cultural fit. It's just the right man for the right job.

I still think Glasgow will take care of this one. Rory Stane, dad of Kyle, turns out to be quite the avid fan of the Laker rugby part. And I'll just, you know, I'll sort of cite to Rory at this point and say, happy camp, happy team, ready to go. So whatever the wobbles were, he's telling me, sorted. one thing they are really good at is soaking up pressure they corner flag really well their scramble defense is the best in the league just a little bit better than the Stormers they're right there about try denial and so I find that teams that are not used to having I'll use a tennis analogy you hit a great shot but it comes back to you and you're not ready for that one to come back I think that's what Glasgow will do to you like we should have scored and they don't and you don't score and the denial of that can be really sapping.

And then the final thing is they're really good at using the kick to create quick ball. They're really good at using that as a tactic and not so much trying to kick the leather off the ball, but getting it where a guy like Kyle Stane can get it back and then creating that sort of momentum. Kick again sometimes, you know, kick, regain, kick again, and then keep putting you in the corner and put Connacht where they're not used to be. Absolutely. i mean i send them via the stats to put on the screen um afterwards but i i was i done the head stats for every single quarterfinal and there really not much difference so you could argue that these are the two most similar teams but as you rightly say harry the kicking strategy is the biggest difference connective kicked nearly 300 meters sorry nearly i correct myself nearly 3 000 meters further over the course of a season which makes more sense 300 meters wouldn't be very far over a season but um that is a probably the big difference i mean if you look at if you want to go off percentage differences you could look at scrum pens where glasgow have 47 percent more but if you look at the actual numbers that's only seven it's 22 versus 15 so over an 18 game season it's nothing line breaks is a pretty big difference in defenders beaten so glasgow have 166 to conax 118 and 518 defenders beaten to conax 408 so that's a big difference but we know that glasgow are a team that's their dna right they like to hold the ball they like to go through multiple multiple long possessions which gives you an opportunity to rack up these numbers so if conax have the ball less which is what the kicking stats would suggest you know they've kicked conax have actually only kicked 40 times more over the season over 18 games but have racked up 3 000 extra meters so that is the big difference between the two all right i have to admit my i'm a bit torn here i I like the Glasgow, I support Glasgow because it's a South African connection, Francois Smith, Carl Steyn and everybody.

But I wouldn't mind if Kornach won because if the Bulls beat Munster, which Harry says they won't, and I said they definitely will, semi-final will be at Loftus. I mean, that to me is a big bonus. We've better to play it over here than over there. What do you think, Harry? Oh, yeah, for sure.

By the way, I do think the Bulls will win. I just think that they might struggle a bit. Yeah, I think this just sets up for one of those things where for about 45 minutes it's competitive and then it's not. And so I will go down and I will predict a route and a sad one for my friends from Galway. Well, can we move on to the Bulls now?

Because I put out my feelers this morning to the Bulls coaching staff and I'm not going to say who I spoke to. And I said, who would you have preferred, Lions or Munster? And he said, ah, it's more, you know, it's much for the muchness. They prepare, they play the team. You said to coach hackers over breakfast this morning as they were sharing a boiled egg.

what do you think is this going to happen and uh no it wasn't him and then um the point is they were holding hands you like you said i was having to explain the stormers um obsession that we've developed on this on this channel so and i had to explain that you know it's going to come around i promise it's not it's not permanent this is a temporary affliction anyway so the point that they were making was that maybe the one thing they would prefer playing against Munster for is the fact that they have to travel, it's at altitude. They played them just the other day. I was in the Bulls that week when they prepared for Munster and I know the plans didn't work out exactly how they wanted to, but now they know what didn't work and I suppose that'll make a difference, Harry. I mean, it should. It's interesting when I think about Bulls and Munster, I immediately go to the one I went to in Limerick and how big a thing it was to beat them.

And at the time, it felt like a giant achievement you know um now away but still it just there was a mystique attached to monster monster has really self-inflicted a lot of uh problems on themselves so in the in the time that he elapsed it doesn't feel like that it feels like it would be the other way around that this would be one of the historic wins for monster to on a sick season a malfunctioning season where everything's dysfunctional coach the thing didn't work out um a lot of acrimony about the budgets and where'd the money go and the sort of sick feeling of cork versus limerick and and jealousy and envy and people coming out with books you know conor murray and peter omahony on all these shows talking about how horrible this is and etc wouldn't it be just like monster not just as a monster rugby people but as a Munsterman in life, like their personality, wouldn't it be just like them to come and do this? I mean, that's why I'm saying it's the only possible upset for this round to me. I think the top four teams are going to be ready and take care of business. But if there was one, I had to put some money on it, I would say Munster because I could just... Hugh, I can see Munster being that way.

They always are that way. They're not a club that does logic or things the easy way. And like I said earlier, teams who go on a run, they finished seventh on the log and won the title going away these incredible away runs and like you mentioned crowley before i was looking at the stats that i was kindly uh helped out by sean from ultimate rugby shared a couple of tidbits with me and he um jack crowley so sean does the the battle stats for players i don't know if it's the same formula as what razzy does or a similar one but jack crowley was the highest non-winger in the battle stats which is interesting so i'm going to dig more into that but he just is that again craig casey carried them to a win over the lions craig casey wasn't on that field the lions win that game every day of the week in my opinion and you are right it would just be so them to just go and do this i don't think they will i don't think that's the likely outcome but actually if you go from a stats point of view which i totally agree harry you can't really statify munster it doesn't they don't work like that but the big difference this is the one on the stats that you could say could be the most one-sided which i know you might think it might be stormers cardiff which we'll talk to talk about in a minute but this could be the one that turns into a real blowout like the big difference between the two is the scrums so scrum penalties one bulls 42 to monster 16 that's 163 percent difference uh scrum offenses so penalties conceded at the scrum bulls 34 monster 55 that's a pretty big difference there's 21 in 18 games and then but then you think oh yeah bulls rugby you know that that's not a surprise you that's not interesting but then line breaks is the other one bulls 168 to monsters 113 it's just the on paper there should be a non-contest but monster aren't about on paper it's funny that you say about the team with problems i saw a monster fan post on socials the other day it's just like some of our problems are not even real problems we just made them up they don't actually exist but it's just how they are so it should be one-sided in the sense that the bulls should score a lot of points the bulls are a high scoring team they um they're at home they're raring to go so the why i think the bulls win by a lot or monster wins by you know a point why would monster ever win by a point i think it's because they're good at negating things so um you take a guy like ty burn is he actually playing before i say this is he fit who knows they might just have given him two paracetam on said tiger playing i've seen burn do this to teams before where you have a lot of line breaks, you have a lot of good attack sets, but it doesn't come to anything because he crops up in the wrong place at the wrong time, looks like he's knackered, a minute five, his body shape doesn't look, doesn't speak a pro athlete, and he just sort of winds up there. I mean, you saw with the British and Irish Lions, he did that to the Wallabies, and it can really frustrate a coach. So then you have the problem of what happens if what you've been doing to win all these games the bulls been winning with high scoring if you suddenly you take that away from someone what happens next i mean i think andre paulet knows what to do next but it is that's the one question mark i have that they they have um to go to tennis sorry but if i know i'm playing an opponent that is literally better and they can do all the things better than me i could still beat them if i can play junk tennis if i can put drop shots together if i could put off speed if my lobs keep hitting the back you know the baseline so you know monster can just go in thinking they're better than us let's beat them so what do i what do i do let me just make everything difficult let me foul the line out step into the space take free kicks at scrum so i don't even have penalties i mean there's just lots of things you can do if you're a battle-hardened street fighter i really the one thing that stands out for me um you know you talked about last year at munster and there's sort of a stark difference and a stark similarity as well last year when you went to munster there was that was the weekend when the riot started or the revolt started in munster the coach was you know under pressure under fire and eventually had to go this year's the other way around lots of upheaval like you just said you griffin just said um at munster the coach brought in from the chiefs you know high profile signing, not really, I think, living up to expectations.

So talk to me about that, that side of the thing. How much of a role did that play? The fact that the coaches are maybe the common denominator or the lack of coaching, I suppose. Yeah, it's almost like you handed whatever acrimony you had, you put it in a parcel and just left it there, steaming turd on the table. Why?

I don't get it. I was very wrong about Clayton McMillan. I thought he was not only the perfect antidote for what ailed Munster, he's just always been such a good coach, in my opinion, how he coaches, how he gets there. He's a bit grim, I guess, maybe. But I even thought that would fit.

I thought that would fit the Munster vibe, and he'd be kind of old school. Just for whatever reason, hasn't. One part is that they were living on the sort of golden generation of players, and a lot of them left at the same time. That's a big effect. So he just might not be working with the top talent.

So yeah, it's very strange. They switch places. And also, we don't really know. It's like in any kind of organization. You only really know what's really happening when key people leave.

That's when everyone starts to tell the real story. So we don't really know even what all is going on in Munster. It's just something rotten. Something rotten is spewing there. i think it's easy to forget as well with graham roundtree when he left he left suddenly and under suspicious circumstances he they were doing a tour down in south africa at the time and he just came out boom he's gone and this was not long after they won the usc it was like yeah he's by the way we don't want him anymore and it was the the suggestion was i don't know if it's true i don't know the true story but the suggestion was that it was kind of the players kind of said we're not to this guy and i think that's what conor murray said in his book as well so you know you don't want to go throwing accusations about culture and things but you know all is clearly not well and culture of things yeah right let's talk about the bulls about you um we've been talking about the fact that they might not survive knockouts of the style of rugby maybe not this year maybe next year what's your feeling on that i mean you've been i've spoken to new the brain we understand his philosophy in terms of attack and everything else we also know a couple of other things that that you said recently what are you thinking about the bulls way of playing in a knockout match i think they'll turn up and the thing about the bulls is they score loads and loads of points which is going to help i don't see anybody restricting the bulls to can anybody in the league really restrict the bulls to fewer than four tries in the 80 maybe three maybe clasco could at home but that's always going to so when you're playing the bulls you know like okay we're probably gonna have to score four or five tries to even be in a chance of winning this and you've got the you've got the scrum that's the one thing and the what that's what helps with you with playing at home as well and this is going to be one of my main points when we talk about the stormers is when it's actually in pretoria the referee might be a bit more amenable to not protecting the weaker scrum or not allowing the weaker scrum to get folded and still play so you'll always have that and monster scrum is not very good so that that's what's going to help you so as long as you've got the scrum and you've got the ability to score tries that's going to help and you've got 100 pollards is going to engage world cup mode and kick incredible 50 meter penalties then you're you're a lot of the way there then it's going to take a a big implosion i think for you to lose especially at home however we have seen it you know we talked we used um a few months ago we used the analogy of recovering alcoholics like and how you're you even when you don't drink anymore you start you're still an alcoholic it's just you don't drink anymore and it's kind of that with teams as well like we are still the team that can just completely screw it up at any moment we haven't been lately but we're still the same people i like the we I wanted to ask you the one difference you uh Harry that uh you Griffin is referring to I'm gonna say you griff otherwise it sounds like I'm saying you this might Africa not getting my getting around that last time the bunch that won at Loftus it was late at in the day late at night something this is one o'clock on a Saturday afternoon and it's not particularly hard you and I were exchanging uh pictures of our various temperatures today you was having a fit because it's so it was only 24 degrees or something, it was 24, up to 24 I mean and I said that's only 22, but I'm going to go with you.

What's the difference of the time of day you're going to make, do you think? I could, I don't really think it'll be to the benefit of Munster to have any kind of weather event. So we learned in Bilbao that apparently Irish people cannot handle any 28 degrees and sunlight it's like they're vampires um no so that that's not on their favor i so the reason why the bulls should win uh quite easily even though they're an attack-minded team and that's not normally your best friend knockouts is they have 15 springbok forwards and of those i don't know eight or nine are proper like i mean you know established they have two packs is my point so So what Ackerman had before with the Lions, he didn't have that sometimes. You know, he had more of a mobile, you know. So if someone tries to take the Bulls into a stodgy set-piece-to-set-piece affair, I think they'll be quite happy with Pollard directing traffic and two-packs.

So that's where they have the hedge that maybe he didn't have as Lions. So knock on Ackerman is he gets the finals and loses the final, the grand final. It's not that he loses in the first round, you know. it's the Buffalo Bills syndrome of getting to the Super Bowl over and over and losing the same way with the Lions. So what's different now is, like I said, he can play power rugby.

And I don't know where Munster can take them. So the only way I can think about Munster doing this is to spoil it, to junk it up. It's like the spin bowler coming on and looking like you can hit six off him every time, but you cannot find the ball, that kind of stuff. I would literally tell the team to do that. I would say, is it going to be great to frustrate the Bulls today?

I would not go head-to-head. I think head-to-head is a very bad idea, and I think it might blow out horribly for Munster if they do that. Okay, Ari, and you, you've been chomping at the bit to talk about the Stormers. I know you have, both of you. And you, it's sort of those somewhat outdated statistics of yours.

Tell me what you think of this Stormers team and what we can expect. This is a revenge match. I mean, this is Cardiff that beat them in the last round of the UFC. Stormers have a lot to prove here and a score to settle. Absolutely.

It's a revenge match. And I do kind of fear for Cardiff on that point of view. I guess we have the ultimate proof. Like last week, we saw it happen. Cardiff can beat the Stormers.

They literally just did it. But it's obviously a completely different story. If you go down to Cape Town, playing at home in front of the 20,000 to 25,000 Stormers fans, where the referee might have see the scrum a little bit differently the second time around i mean i don't think there's anything wrong with how andrew brace saw the scrum in terms of that is what referees are told to do nowadays is if a team's getting mullered just let them get away with it whereas if they're actually doing that in cape down in the dhl stadium are they going to be you know maybe give in to the crowd shouts and screams so if i'm looking at the scrum penalties won the storm is the most of any team in the urc with 60 in 18 games cardiff 13 it's quite a big difference um and then set piece as well there's a big difference in line outs one the stormers and we know them all we know how important the mall is to the stormers scoring and i i don't see that cardiff are going to be able to compete on that what's interesting is the kicking game i think that that's one thing where i'd be interested to see how the cardiff and the stormers take it on because we know that the storm is a massive part of their attack is contestable kicks the scraps kick returns and things like that cardiff kick more than stormers cardiff kick some one of the most in in the league uh 474 kicks to the stormers this season 546 to cardiff so a 70 kicks difference so it would be interesting to see if cardiff managed to frustrate the stormers there and i do think you know if i if i take the welsh point of view here i do think that that is the best strategy for cardiff is they need to frustrate the stormers because cardiff make significantly more tackles nearly 800 more tackles over the season so if cardiff can make the stormers go to ruck six seven or eight then will that start getting under the skin of the stormers players and they be thinking why can we just beat these guys as easily as we think they should and that they kind of just feed off that a bit connor kind of did that as well a little bit when it was there they just got under the stormers skin but you know the smart money is on the Stormers taking retribution this weekend. And I think if they do do that, it's a bit like what Harry said with Bulls Munster, is that you think that the home side should win, and if they do, it should be by up to 20 points. Yeah, I think Stormers are going to score 50 points, maybe seven tries, maybe more.

And I think they're going to try to do this every way. So beat them up, run around them, run through them. tell them what they're going to do, tell them what they just did, remind them of what they did after that. You know, we got to hear some great inside audio. I won't tell you who was talking to who and what, but I'll just say it's a very, very, very, very good player talking inside.

And you could tell the intensity. And you were getting goosebumps listening to it, you know, of a guy that you know, but we won't say his name. talking about it and realizing how much it means to the stormers to set this right and it was um it was scary it was a bit bone tingling i think yeah i think it's a lot i think yeah it and and it was not someone that you would associate with that kind of language so i think they're very upset with themselves like we talked about a word that we have to invent called self fury of some kind so it's not about cardiff cardiff did what they're supposed to do fair play that's great um but in terms of just sweeping them aside you know take just yeah it has to go away and move them away i think when it does function like it has against lanster in glasgow this season it's looked very very good it's worked badly when um at phase four phase five the attack starts to become frenetic instead of um methodically powerful so it it's it can almost spin out of control it's like a yo-yo and you think it's going well and suddenly it's all tangled up that's what the stormers attack has done from time to time when it gets in there gets into the red zone and then spins its wheels and then almost the quicker the rock the worse it gets because it's going to the wrong player without a cleaner and then like hugh says frustration sets in so i think that's you know that's that's the uh the downside but i do think it's going to be a revenge um it's going to be setting things right there's a lot of good news inside the camp there's a sort of a fresh air with these recruitments going so well with so many bucks coming vilco low sia kulisi uh chess and colby and more to come i'll just say that i know some inside there so um the feeling is like they're ahead they're ahead on on the five-year project in year two they're ahead of where they're supposed to be so let's go ahead and and you know shock the world and dubbo's done a lot of good inside talking about us against the world using any critique you know like by hugh as um fodder as fuel and that's normal every coach does that so it's not a big deal so um yeah i think i think that's it by the way uh for those who are saying that maybe it's a bit too stormers on the lack of rugby pod i don't know if anyone would turn down interviews with Damien Willemster. We're talking to him tomorrow. It's kind of hard to do that.

So, Sharks, if you want, if Sharks fans, if you want your team to be featured as much as the Stormers, get Ox and, you know, Ibn Etzebeth to be on our show. We'd like to have them. Help us, man. My machtag. Just let us stop begging.

Really, honestly. Stop complaining and do something about it. Yeah, that's it. It's kind of hard to say, no, guys, we don't want to talk to you. I mean, he's the most fascinating player and has been for a long time.

And next week we have, you know, Sasha on. So, you know, we're just going to keep, if they keep giving us this type of caliber, we're not going to turn Chessie down. So Chesson Colby is going to be on our pod later this year. Why wouldn't we? Definitely not.

A couple of bulls coming as well. Make no mistake, people. I mean, I can't be left behind here. I have to make a couple of... This pod is getting a bit stormy.

So I have to counter it. I'm working at it flat out. now i i sorry just one thing sorry you we were accused of not holding the coaches feed to the fire and that's for example the attack plan that you talked about just now in the 22 and you you talked about this a lot for example that game against toulon but they kept bashing away and bashing away bashing away is that a coaching problem is that a planning problem or is it just you know the the pressure of the moment what's what's happening there okay so let me just level with you um dear lecker viewer nation i actually believe especially in the role of interlocutor or if i'm doing an interrogation to let the person uh be who they are so when we talk to dave's name i let davi say whatever he wants to say you can take from that out you will but what i don't really want is to have that sort of grimy journalist snarky thing where you go oh so you don't know know what you're doing like i don't know where that gets me it's ridiculous obviously he this is his trade he's a professional he's coached in sri lanka before he's worked he's paid his dues um i've seen the the rips and the reviews that the stormers have post match it's incredibly deep and intricate so whatever it is that we're saying he doesn't know he knows but he might have a different way of going about it but i do believe in interviews of of you know letting the person have enough comfort and relaxation and ease that they end up telling you what they are and who they and who they are and and and the worst way to get people to open up an interview is to start uh characterizing them in broad strokes on you know minute five guess what you get out of them a minute ten nothing you're just gonna get the same old same old so defensive yeah i think it it was fine um and when i went back and listened to it i thought i gave him enough structure there uh rouen l was great at you know talking us through about how some of these things happen um all the players and the coaches have been able to express freely so that's what we're trying to give you is that if you're going for gotcha that's another channel we don't go for gotcha that's the one thing i said in that comment as well when i replied to that ex-stormer supporter you said there can't be such a thing as an ex-Stormus supporter. Yeah, who are you? Come on.

I don't believe that. Really? The point is that we're trying to educate people. We're listening and we're hearing things from these coaches and players that we've never heard before. I've never heard it.

I don't know if you heard it. Maybe you have, but I haven't. So for me, that's the point. We get to know these people. We get to learn how they think and how it works.

So holding the feet to the fire. I mean, what does it mean? You know, like you said, scoring gotcha points, this is not a channel for you. Thank you very much. Hugh, you wanted to say something about the Stormus?

Let's hear it. it's just i'm so excited to talk about what the team's gonna look like next season i know that's not the point of the previews of the quarterfinal but like the the signing of cheslin like it's so good like it works it's it's not just like a hollywood thing obviously there's the romantic side of it of is it cape town boy coming home and stuff and but and that's the cool thing about the three big box signings is they're all cape town boys and they're all coming home so they can play that card with all of them but i'm just thinking now like sasha sia cheslin villimsa and then you got kind of like second tier box if you want to call them that of like um vilko low uh kobus it's like when do we start calling the stormers the galacticos if you sign if day lende comes back i'm calling you the galacticos from from now on yeah it's fascinating uh when you look at exactly what is going on inside Stormer Camp, what one thing would they wish? When you're playing a click attack, a transition rugby, and you're hoping for those quick strikes, you want to score within four phases. Chesson Colby, Louis Bielberet and Chesson Colby would be the two people that you immediately think of where you don't need to give them much. You just look at the tries that were scored with a Sasha to Chesson connection.

And maybe even that connection set up another person for a try. But that, it almost seemed telepathic. So, and that's probably, you know, when you're a really great athlete like Sasha is, you can feel let down sometimes. Like you pulled off something really amazing and then there's no one there to really support you. Cheslin is that guy.

So, I'm with you. That's an interesting. And then you have all these Swiss army knives because whether it's Damien, Sasha, Cheslin, they've all played multiple positions i mean chesslin's played 15 he's dropped gold from 55 meters in um in the top 14. uh damien's played 10 for a lot of his career at bach level there's a lot of mix and match there that seems kind of intriguing but also um a good headache so yeah maybe it also puts pressure on the link the wings that are playing this weekend to like you know keep me don't throw me out it's it is paul de villiers i feel sorry for like you had a great run bro but it's see it see isn't now i mean if you're the storm's commercial manager you're just like ringing up any company just like hey do you want to be our jerseys next year we've got sasha and sia both are having the same jersey do you want to be on it like that that's got to be a commercial tap-in but i actually think that c is being underrated as the impact they'll have like people just like always like it was a bit like this in soccer with david beckham is his brand became so big that people forgot what he's like as a rugby player it's like watch see a play he's amazing and he definitely makes almost any team better so i'm looking forward to seeing him in a stormers jersey i just thought about it because i've been more excited about the rugby side of it and kind of listening to the inside insights on it but such a see a chess line i mean is there a is there a troika in rugby that has more social media pull and you'd have to almost go to Bordeaux at this point or maybe a French team to even compete with that. I mean Justin Colby has for a long time had an incredible international appeal and he cuts across all kinds of barriers.

It's a very interesting play like you say that goes beyond rugby. I just can't wait to watch it. I think it's going to be phenomenal and what I like about it is it's arguably the biggest team in the URC acting like the biggest team in the URC. Like yeah This is us. We are the URC to lose.

It's a statement to Leinster because Leinster has been that. So maybe it's, I still don't think it gets there compared, I'm on caps, I mean. But at least it's saying we could go, we could compete in two season, two tournaments. Because Paul De Villiers and Sia Khaleesi, you're right. There's some platooning going on.

It's a very injured position though, open sider. And so it's good to have you. That's what ends up having the teams that win have 12, 14 forwards of quality. They have to. And so I think it's a good play.

I also don't think that it's Galactico because these are, like you say, people coming home. And there's a power to that as well. Harry, we spoke to Neil Lyokovs yesterday. He's the pool's high performance manager. One of the questions I asked him was, does he get a sort of brief from the coaches in terms of, like I said, I used the example of getting someone who can go 0-205 seconds and can still scrum a tight head or something like that.

And also, you know, can you identify a player coming up through the ranks somewhere at a high school or something? And he said it's a bit of both, a bit of a hybrid. So now you can look at these signings, SIA and Cheslin. I mean, they are big names, but they still have to come home and fit into the scheme of things, the plan that the Stormers are working towards, 2029. We keep hearing, what's that plan?

What do these signings tell you where the Storm is going? To be able to compete in two competitions is the gold standard. I think what we were saying with Pat McCary recently, all it takes is one strong run in the Champions Cup for a South African team and everyone will get into the magic. We are definitely a wait and see, let's see if we're winning and then suddenly go crazy. That's what it's waiting for.

To do that, you know from working with the Bulls inside how much planning goes on month to month, 12 weeks out, 20 weeks out. The minute you start adding redundancies, but they're good ones, you are getting there. If I can plot my loose forwards and I have Ruan Ackerman, Evan Ruas, Ben Jason Dixon, Paul de Villiers, Marcel Tieneson, And Sia Khaleesi, I start to be able to fashion a journey through the two competitions. And I have something there in case of contingency. I mean, injuries are actually a certainty, but I don't know where they're going to happen.

So that's the contingency part. So I just think you have to have probably six or seven props who can scrum at a high level. It's not enough to have three. Yeah, but a good example, Sia and Paul De Villiers are not the same player. I mean, you sent some stats here, you Griffin.

Paul De Villiers with his limited stats, but he had like 100 more rucks than Ben Jason Dixon, for example. He's a completely different player. He's a six. But, I mean, that's why I'm not talking about the depth. I understand the style of play.

It's two different things here. Ben Jason Dixon is a proper blindsider, and so he's tackling. and his tackles lead to Paul de Villiers' interventions, slowings, jackals, pilfers. So you'll want to see, you don't want Paul de Villiers to be turned into a tackler. That's the best way to negate the jackler.

Sia has always been a tweener between a six and a seven or a seven and a six, doesn't matter how you play it. He's almost like a 6.5. And the Sharks have used him a lot at eight. I foresee that happening with the Stormers later in his career play more as a Kieran Reid type eight, good hands, play in the trams.

Sia Khaleesi still has some of the best open field carry stats and outcomes of any player anywhere. That's not Ben Jason Dixon's game. He can get out there, but it's not really his game. Paul De Villiers is more of a link man. Think about almost a tearaway flank from the 1990s, Michael Hooper type.

You know, Paul's really quick. So that's different. so I think when you take the core of all the loosies of the Stormers when you add a SIA you can see adaptation there and Hugh I don't know what you think but I think that's the next level when you start to try to become the big team is you can match you can game plan a game and have a very different feel a different team for Cardiff versus Glasgow you've got to be able to switch it up and I think if you can have that Sia Khaleesi being the hard carrier along with Ruiz you know and maybe maybe he's maybe that's what you do is you have Ruiz and then you have Sia finishing the game so give me 30 minutes of just running downhill at people you know I think those are all possibilities and we know it's a psychological thing that when teams empty the bench like we know with the bomb squad we've had it in the past like two people who play against Toulouse talk about this all the time you've just you've just spent 60 minutes dealing with evan ruis and then see a release is coming on god's sake like i've got to do this now and it's sometimes just adding adding more better is more better you know he's definitely a player who are on quality starts with the stormers and it just helps and definitely changing the picture i mean that's that's how a big reason that leinster managed to get back into against ubb is having kieran frowley at 10 kieran frowley at 10 he completely played completely differently to harry byrne and okay ubb had very much taken their foot off the gas they actually started resting players for the next top 14 game at one point or maybe they're just resting them for the party afterwards who knows but um that's one of the reasons that leinster were able to be a bit more respectable in that second half is they had a guy changing the pitches and that can be the difference in a close game where you think you've just about got a guy figured out and he's off and a completely different guy comes on and there are teams in the urc who can't do that as well remember this storm is disappointed that they didn't finish top there were two wins away from finishing top so does sia kalisi and cheslin colby bridge two wins yeah i think cheslin colby is worth a couple of wins by himself we've learned that at every level everywhere he's gone he's been able to seize the moment and then sia kalisi um regardless of where you see him as a captain and all that stuff as a player um you know i would just ask i i would look at some of the stats that i've seen about him in defenders beaten um successful carries when fit he is a devastating uh player out there i don't think they're gonna want to overplay him so at 34 years old think turning 35 soon you don want i don think buckland wants him to do that But imagine imagine using him in these 30 spurts Absolutely wonderful. Before we move on to Lainstead versus Lions, and we have a lot to say about that. Pat McCary, I said a nice interesting conversation on the previous Lackarack Report.

Make sure you watch that. The link's up here. So my homework is that you need to like and subscribe to this video. Make sure you subscribe to this channel. If you're not, just, you know, just double check.

I think people often think that they are and they end up not being. and that's the first thing and secondly if you want to get notified of new videos make sure you join our whatsapp channel youtube does not send out enough notifications anymore that is becoming a problem so we want to make sure that you get notified and you don't miss any of our videos so let's move on swiftly to leinster versus lion so the start of you you let's start with the bigger picture you know what are we expecting leinster licking the wounds you know back breathing fire or sort of retreating into feeling sorry for themselves what are we what are we expecting A lot of people are saying, are Leinster going to be a shadow of themselves because of that humiliation in the Champions Cup final, which is what I think it was. I think the scoreline flattered Leinster, if anything. But I actually kind of think it would be the most Leinster thing to come out and put 50 or 60 on the Lions now. Because that's what they did last year when they lost to Northampton Saints in the semi-final.

Then the next thing they put 70 on Zebra. And everyone was like, well done, congratulations. Yes, you did it. I can see it being that I think it would be more Leinster to now come out and look amazing against the Lions and everyone be like, well, okay, cool. You did it in the game where there was no pressure, relatively little pressure, obviously a knockout game and there's some pressure.

So I kind of more expect that to happen. I would say to you guys in the WhatsApp group from the stats point of view, it's weird. These two teams that we know because we've watched them, how different they are. Teams that have almost nothing in common. their stats are so similar like the kicks retained 94 to 80 again over uh an 18 game season nothing turnovers lost 252 to 220 nothing again penalties conceded 177 161 kicks 481 459 from the start you say these teams are the same but we know they're completely opposite type style teams you've got an out of possession team versus a possession team and i think the one thing that people might be surprised to hear is the scrum is that leinster's scrum is clearly better than the lions out of the south african teams the lions are the scrum which is most just let's just restart the restart the game and play whereas leinster's scrum is more of a weapon especially because they're going to be playing in dublin and we all know by now sorry if there's any leinster fans watching you're gonna get a stupid decision if you're playing in dublin that just gives Leinster a try.

It just happens in every single one, or at least gives them a three-pointer. I'm a Scarlet's fan. We've played in the league long enough to know that it's a guarantee. So I think it's going to be an uphill battle for the Lions. I don't think they've got no chance.

I don't think that it's completely out of the question, but I'm not expecting an upset in this one. I'm expecting a bit of a non-event of the game, a game where people maybe tune in thinking because Leinster lost the final in such the way they did, that they're there for the taking and then it being quite a drab two-score win. Yeah, I think so too. The depth also matters here because the Lions have lost a lot of players. And to get there, to get all the way, that's a lot of what happens is the depth.

The depth will out. It is one of the problems for Glasgow probably to get three more levels. Bulls have the players. Storm was there or thereabouts Leinster definitely has the players So I think at some point it's just You know, dropping like flies It's a I don't know what Jake White say, Mbia That you sort of lose 1.5 players per week or something And you get sort of One back, but in the end the exchange rate Is that you'll be 3 or 4 players Your net rate is 1.

5 So that's a problem for the Lions Right now, having lost Ruan Fenton and those guys Because they were they were getting good carry like meters per carry they were doing good defensive they were like busting tackles that's how they were kind of getting there um whereas leinster has been getting around contact and keeping the ball and doing this very laborious thing and i think they got enough people to do this this intricate pattern which came unwound against the quick score bordeaux um it'll be i think it's plenty it'll be enough to beat the lions unfortunately I think the larger issues are and we cannot tell what's going on behind the scenes right now but it's got to be peak hand wringing and people coming out whispering, the whisper campaign about Leo is happening right now and I say Leo because it's kind of stupid to say that we need Jacques Nienaber to prove himself at this level He's already proved himself at the highest level. And the same players, this effective sort of group of Leinster players, has been in the top three when put into test format for six, seven years now. They've hovered in, they've been number one in the world at times. And just adding Bundy Aki and Tyburn. But it's pretty much these players.

So the onus is on Leo to show what he is not doing, that Andy Farrell is doing and why he cannot harness and exploit Jean-Doc Nenard by the way Rassia Rasmus does. So it's all on him. And enough people have told me behind the scenes that it looks like he's not always knowing why they lost and why they lost badly. And there's a bit of marginalization of Jacques. I think that's where all the heat is.

And a narrative started to develop. I hate the word narrative, but there it is. The narrative has started to develop that leo just doesn't have that cutting edge ruthless you know man management that andy farrell has and the ability to throw in curveballs he's too easy to predict to predict and right when he should let let um he should open his hands and let jock take more he takes it in and so he's over controlling right when he shouldn't be and then um a little bit clueless about how the game is shaping where it doesn't really pay unless you're a superior team it doesn't really pay to just go out there and run 20 phases they work so hard to get that first try in bilbao that they were almost done for the day like it looked like to do those 20 19 phases and score it's almost like they shouldn't have it would have been better if they just kicked it away and and salvage some of their energy um air and you've been saying this for a while they work too hard to score so it's yeah nope so they'll beat the lions that probably yeah it'll be tough to beat in the urc but it's not going to solve the overall problem right now now we saw it when they won the urc last season when they beat the balls it was kind of like a okay well at least no one can say that we haven't won anything you know again and i think as you said harry it would be the most boring outcome if the first team to win two urcs was leinster even though that is probably likely you know i think we probably need the bulls to win it this season if we want to keep this run going of a different winner every season but the i like you have spoken to a couple of people close to leinster and you're struggling to find someone with who who leaps to leo's defense i've never seen it i've never seen someone say no leo is the guy it's not his fault that's not anything that i've heard from anybody ever and i did speak to one person though who said like the thing about leo is he's so he's like one of those i don't want to call him a weed because that's really mean and horrible but he's like one of those plants where the roots just go for miles there's just like a little plant here but you dig under the surface and they're part of everything and it's a you have to be a bit of a politician you know i shrugby if we come back to the monster thing there's a lot of off-field stuff that you've got to manage as well it's not just about coaching the guys monday to friday and picking the team and supposedly leo is very into everything behind the scenes he's mr leinster so you can't just rip him out it's not as simple as that so you know they're in a bit of a thing but like like we said in our game review in our live reaction leo's leo needs to have if not like handing in his badge and his gun he needs to look in the and have a conversation with himself and say, okay, I need to change something drastically. What is it going to be? You know, he needs to make a change before somebody else does.

Yeah, I was talking to Birch Jackman and Bernard was talking about, for a while he's talked about the change in rugby and how a lot of it was black and white back in the day, which is the way it was taught at Leinster and has built this machine. But a lot of it now is in the gray and fractured play, ball bouncing around, general play, much more space around the catch and the kick and the chip space. Why was Leinster only kicking that many times? I don't know, 18, 19 times. And not very many of those were diagonals or pounces or squibs.

It was mostly boxes and clearances. And why was it just seen like old school, whereas Bordeaux is this sort of avatar, this sort of perfect quintessential example of how rugby is supposed to be played now, With more space around the ruck, the nine has more ability to go roaming, but also the variety of kicks. That's all an attack issue. The attack coach at Leinster, it's been a bit of a turnstile. It's not really clear who's got the reins.

It's interesting because it seems like everyone just immediately goes to defense. I'm sure Jacques Nienaber wished that they had stopped Bordeaux better, more, and easier. but holding them to about what their average is is at subpar. That's not good for Ninobe, but it's about what any team has been able to do with Bordeaux. It was going to be really important to score.

They were never going to be held to 25 points. I mean, that just wasn't going to happen realistically. Not with the way the game has been officiated with the ball and play time, with the number of attack sets and the number of miscues when you try to play that much rugby from your middle third into the attacking third, then you get the intercept. And then suddenly you're looking down the barrel. So Leo doesn't seem to be able to capture that in press conferences.

He doesn't seem to be able to capture that. And so he'll do fine in a game where there's a player mismatch. The Leinster will have a player mismatch with the Lions. They just have way more internationals. Josh Van der Fleer, Caelan Dara.

I mean, just keep throwing people like that. They should win. Yeah, I think the only chance that the Lions have is to do exactly what UBB did, which is score early, go three scores up, and then you're forcing Leinster to abandon their DNA again. And then they're playing out of their own 22 again. And the loser the game gets, the Lions are the loosest team in the URC.

So it suits them. So if the Lions can get 21 points on the board in the first 30 minutes, then it's interesting. But you suspect the Leinster machine might go. But just coming back to finish your point on Jack, if you look at two of those tries an intercept and the one where the ball is kicked by a ubb player it ricochets off a lencer player damien pano kind of gets to it first offloads it to ubb and he runs past two men it's like there's there's no defensive system error there it's bullshit it just happens for for players who were incredible just executing in a moment like you said that's the gray there but there you go two out of the five tries nothing to do with jack absolutely nothing to do with jack And two of the three tries that were scored against his defense were Rico Owani looking very much at sea, being the highest high winger ever, and looking really uncomfortable. And I'm not really even dumping on Rico.

I don't know how much time in the saddle he had, and it's a very difficult defense to learn when you're a wing. And the 13 wing in a blitz, the Ninaba blitz, is unbelievably difficult. But it did look like he was either over-amped, And also he was blitzing and hitting nothing. You know, it was just like a blitz into nowhere. And that left everyone else looking, you know, foolish.

So again, I don't know who picked. Here's the problem with Leinster is who picks? Like who's the final selector? That's never been clear to me because it seems to suit Leo to distance himself from losses when he needs to, I think, claim credit for it. I don't know in the final analysis if they have an argument who wins that yeah when just quickly Enrico Ioane I just checked that was his third game on the wing for Leinster was the Champions Cup final and you like you say in the new Nava system why are you taking such a risk okay he's played 13 but still he only just got here man and on that when I was in a press conference with Leo he brought the selection came up a lot and the churn of players and he kept talking about oh we haven't had players available and your point there about him distancing himself from it it was like he wouldn't take any responsibilities like oh well you know the team's changing every week so you know we're always going to have some roping moments always going to be slow to get going it's like what don't you pick the team leo like if you're not picking the team who is you i got the sense i mean it there's some people might say this is tinfoil hat whatever you say but i got the sense that someone at the irfu is picking leinster's team and saying we want these guys to get minutes exactly the point that you made before harry about urc teams are predominantly for supporting the test sides whereas the top 14 clubs are just for themselves and you kind of get that feeling with leinster it was like is this really this is the the thing that leinster have to decide if they do want to win more trophies is are we here to for the success of leinster or are just an island training camp an extended island training camp because if they're an extended island training camp same shit's going to keep happening lastly more than i stand today that christmas is now the best fly off in south africa that's a lot of weight from uh from more than spain to say that harry what's your thoughts on that and then i'll ask you as well that's so bloody cool man i love more than saying that that's exactly what i would do if i was in issues I mean, it's not true, but it's fun.

Yeah, he's the guy, what did Ringo call him? The guy that you're supposed to marry because he would start the bra on time and have all the right provisions, but he wouldn't, you'd end up with the other guy. So he's a nice guy. He's got the perfect comb over before his time. He always looks a little bit tired.

He's a bit like Tyburn. He doesn't look like he's always in professional athlete shape. But he's a good, smart player. I like him. I like him as sort of that bedrock pick in a club.

He'd be my second. He'd be my backup flyoff and be really happy about it every time. If I, oh, we have to go to Chris, we're good, we're fine. He's not going to give you the match. He's going to make you earn it.

And he's also fantastically precise with his kicks. So, no, great. I don't think he's a generational player, but he's cool. You look very skeptical there. He doesn't have the statistics.

It's such a funny thing to say. I don't have any stats to hand to talk about this. i think the best rugby player wearing 10 in south africa at the moment is clearly sasha if you go around the other ones you've got to obviously talk about hondre pard and there were people who always pick him and that's up to them that's absolutely fine and there's plenty of um evidence to back that up i don't think it's chris smith i'm i'm interested about this siya guy at the lions uh at the sharks sorry i mean i don't know hardly anything about him but i've seen a couple of highlights it looks good so i'm excited to see him moving forward but as you know ember if we're just talking about the best south african fly half it is and will always be regardless of what evidence comes to light manila bock okay guys this has been a long one this is a bumper playoff preview so thank you for that i I think we made into a lot of details. It was good. Appreciate it.

Thanks, man. Cheers. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

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